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Topic Title: DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu
Topic Summary:
Created On: 03/02/2018 11:48 AM
Status: Post and Reply
Linear : Threading : Single : Branch
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - xxtraloud - 03/02/2018 11:48 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Lunis Orcutt - 03/02/2018 12:09 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - xxtraloud - 03/02/2018 01:43 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Lunis Orcutt - 03/02/2018 05:00 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Chucker - 03/04/2018 02:41 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Tiger Feet - 03/05/2018 11:56 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Chucker - 03/05/2018 12:19 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Tiger Feet - 03/05/2018 12:41 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - lennois - 03/05/2018 01:19 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Lunis Orcutt - 03/05/2018 07:34 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - monkey8 - 03/06/2018 04:16 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - xxtraloud - 03/12/2018 11:09 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Lunis Orcutt - 03/12/2018 11:17 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - monkey8 - 03/12/2018 02:26 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Tiger Feet - 03/06/2018 06:17 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - monkey8 - 03/06/2018 01:40 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Future_Ethics - 03/06/2018 02:07 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Tiger Feet - 03/07/2018 06:34 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - monkey8 - 03/07/2018 07:21 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Jole - 03/07/2018 02:00 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - monkey8 - 03/07/2018 03:39 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - lennois - 03/08/2018 12:36 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Jole - 03/09/2018 01:28 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - kendonB - 05/24/2019 04:57 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Lunis Orcutt - 05/31/2019 11:42 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Tiger Feet - 06/03/2019 12:58 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Stephan Kuepper - 06/03/2019 03:42 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - harpalus - 06/04/2019 01:06 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Tiger Feet - 06/04/2019 05:34 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Stephan Kuepper - 06/04/2019 03:57 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Stephan Kuepper - 06/04/2019 07:26 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Tiger Feet - 06/04/2019 09:35 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - xxtraloud - 04/24/2020 07:18 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Tiger Feet - 04/24/2020 08:34 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - monkey8 - 04/24/2020 08:48 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - xxtraloud - 04/29/2020 07:17 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - xxtraloud - 05/23/2022 03:32 AM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - monkey8 - 05/23/2022 04:22 PM  
 DragonBar pop-up on Windows start menu   - Alan Cantor - 05/23/2022 09:34 AM  
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 03/02/2018 11:48 AM
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xxtraloud
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since I have installed the 15.3 patch every time I open the start menu in Windows 10 the DragonBar pops up even though I have selected the options to keep it in the tray. This behavior is really annoying as the DragonBar gets in the way of the menus. Is there any way to disable this? And why is this happening if I have DragonBar selected as tray icon?

 

Thank you



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 03/02/2018 12:09 PM
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Lunis Orcutt
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Have you tried putting a check mark in Start Dragon minimized in the tray, under your DragonBar Options/Appearance tab?



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 03/02/2018 01:43 PM
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xxtraloud
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Originally posted by: Lunis Orcutt Have you tried putting a check mark in Start Dragon minimized in the tray, under your DragonBar Options/Appearance tab?

 

 

I can't find that option, I went to tools > options > appearance but it's not there, I have 'tray icon only" selected. I can't find what you mention anywhere else.



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 03/02/2018 05:00 PM
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Lunis Orcutt
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You have made the right choice. Our menus are not exactly the same as yours because we are running DMPE 4.



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 03/04/2018 02:41 PM
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Chucker
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Windows 10 and 8.1 start menu does not have a taskbar. So, the only way you can access Dragon is via the new DragonBar.

This was explained a long time ago when it was first introduced.

Chuck

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 03/05/2018 11:56 AM
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Tiger Feet
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Chuck,

What do you mean by 'Windows 10 & 8.1 start menu does not have a taskbar?'

I have Windows 10 and I have a taskbar and I have Dragon in the tray icon mode so that it shows in the notification area on the bottom right hand side of the taskbar.

I think that xxtraloud means that when he calls up the, "start menu," the Modern DragonBar also comes up even though he has Dragon in the notification area.

I cannot think why this should happen so this must be a bug of some sort because I can confirm it also happens when I call the start menu.

Cheers



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Tiger Feet

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 03/05/2018 12:19 PM
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Chucker
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Show me a screen capture. Then I'll know what you're talking about.

Chuck

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VoiceComputer: the only global speech interface.

The views, thoughts and opinions expressed in this post are my own and do not reflect those of VoiceTeach LLC.

Chuck Runquist
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 03/05/2018 12:41 PM
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Tiger Feet
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I can't because as soon as I bring up the screen capture software, the start menu and Dragon's modern DragonBar disappears.

Anybody can try this. Just call up the start menu in Windows 10 by saying, "start menu" and Dragon's modern DragonBar will show at the top of the screen.

Cheers



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Tiger Feet

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 03/05/2018 01:19 PM
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lennois
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Agreed. This is ridiculous behaviour from Dragon. You can still see the Windows task bar when the Windows 10 start menu is opened, so there is precisely zero reason for the DragonBar to pop up. More generally, DragonBar pops up in all modern apps, which is also highly annoying. For example, I can't use the modern version of VLC to watch a video because I have that ridiculous DragonBar covering part of the movie...

So popping up at the start menu has only been introduced since 15.3?



 03/05/2018 07:34 PM
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Lunis Orcutt
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We can't remember the command Dragon uses to minimize the DragonBar to the taskbar because we have 3 monitors and don't need this capability but there is a Dragon command that we've heard Chuck mention previously. There is probably another command to reestablish the Modern DragonBar but we can't remember this command either, which isn't very helpful. However, we have noted that the DragonBar occasionally crashes and added a feature to restart the DragonBar in KnowBrainer; appropriately called Start DragonBar. This is not exactly the answer you're looking for but perhaps someone might remember those commands.



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 03/06/2018 04:16 AM
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monkey8
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Originally posted by: Lunis Orcutt We can't remember the command Dragon uses to minimize the DragonBar to the taskbar because we have 3 monitors and don't need this capability but there is a Dragon command that we've heard Chuck mention previously. There is probably another command to reestablish the Modern DragonBar but we can't remember this command either, which isn't very helpful. However, we have noted that the DragonBar occasionally crashes and added a feature to restart the DragonBar in KnowBrainer; appropriately called Start DragonBar. This is not exactly the answer you're looking for but perhaps someone might remember those commands.

 

 

 

The commands are "show DragonBar" and "hide DragonBar" and this shows and hides the modern DragonBar. if you never use the modern DragonBar then you have several options:

 

1.  Remove the following line or give an invalid location for the DragonBar executable:

 

"DragonBar Directory=C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\Nuance\NaturallySpeaking15\"

 

from the [Settings] section of the nssystem.ini configuration file and then restart Dragon. You can find the file here (C:\ProgramData\Nuance\NaturallySpeaking15\nssystem.ini)

 

2.  Alternatively you could rename or delete the Dragonbar.exe file in the following location

 

"C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\Nuance\NaturallySpeaking15\dragonbar.exe""



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 03/12/2018 11:09 AM
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xxtraloud
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Originally posted by: monkey8 

 

The commands are "show DragonBar" and "hide DragonBar" and this shows and hides the modern DragonBar. if you never use the modern DragonBar then you have several options:

 

 

 

1.  Remove the following line or give an invalid location for the DragonBar executable:

 

 

 

"DragonBar Directory=C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\Nuance\NaturallySpeaking15\"

 

 

 

from the [Settings] section of the nssystem.ini configuration file and then restart Dragon. You can find the file here (C:\ProgramData\Nuance\NaturallySpeaking15\nssystem.ini)

 

 

 

2.  Alternatively you could rename or delete the Dragonbar.exe file in the following location

 

 

 

"C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\Nuance\NaturallySpeaking15\dragonbar.exe""

 

 

I have tried to rename dragonbar.exe, it made dragon not start anymore from the usual shortcut i had, instead it started the setup procedure. When I click directly on the natspeak.exe the program opened but did not detect any input. I then renamed back dragonbar.exe and Dragon started but with the green microphone I get no recognition. What happened?! How do I troubleshoot this.

 



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 03/12/2018 11:17 AM
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Lunis Orcutt
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Good catch. Lindsay was kind enough to come up with KnowBrainer Show DragonBar command for DPI 14 but it is no longer necessary and we have removed it. You can now use the Dragon built-in show DragonBar, open DragonBar and hide DragonBar commands. However, if the DragonBar crashes, you can use the KnowBrainer Start DragonBar or Open DragonBar commands.



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 03/12/2018 02:26 PM
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monkey8
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I have tried to rename dragonbar.exe, it made dragon not start anymore from the usual shortcut i had, instead it started the setup procedure. When I click directly on the natspeak.exe the program opened but did not detect any input. I then renamed back dragonbar.exe and Dragon started but with the green microphone I get no recognition. What happened?! How do I troubleshoot this.

 

It does not do that on my system nor with Lunis (although I do not know which option of the 2 I suggested he used to stop it) so I would suggest trying option 2 where you remove the line from the nssystem.ini or set to an invalid location, probably the former would be best.



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 03/06/2018 06:17 AM
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Tiger Feet
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We can't remember the command Dragon uses to minimize the DragonBar to the taskbar because we have 3 monitors and don't need this capability but there is a Dragon command that we've heard Chuck mention previously. There is probably another command to reestablish the Modern DragonBar but we can't remember this command either, which isn't very helpful.


Lunis,

The command to minimise the DragonBar to the taskbar is:

"Switch DragonBar to tray icon mode"

The command to have the modern DragonBar is:

"Switch DragonBar to modern mode"

If that is what you meant

Cheers



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Tiger Feet

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 03/06/2018 01:40 PM
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monkey8
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Someone using DPG 15.3 can correct me if I am wrong but the last time I had DPG 15.3 loaded you no longer get the option to use the old style DragonBars so I expect they will become a thing of the past with DPI soon as well.



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 03/06/2018 02:07 PM
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Future_Ethics
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I've also had this issue of the Dragon bar annoyingly popping up even though it should be minimized when I click the start menu in Windows 10. It started after the 15.3 patch.
 03/07/2018 06:34 AM
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Tiger Feet
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Future Ethics,

What you can do when this happens is as Lindsay has mentioned.

You can say, "open task manager" and under 'Processes' in the task manager, highlight the entry that says, 'Dragon DragonBar.'

Then click 'End task' and then when you click on or bring up the start menu, the modern DragonBar will no longer show.

Cheers



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Tiger Feet

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 03/07/2018 07:21 AM
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monkey8
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Also note however, despite what I said earlier, the modern style DragonBar appearing with the start menu is an issue introduced with 15.3 as xxtraloud and futureethics have said and is already in the hands of nuance.

 

Otherwise when the modern Dragon bar appears with modern apps you can use the commands "show DragonBar", "hide DragonBar"but they will not work with the start menu and 15.3 so the only method for now is what I have listed above and what andy has repeated in terms of killing the DragonBar process or permanently removing the modern style DragonBar using the methods I have listed above. The other issues I mentioned in the previous post (now deleted) had already been addressed but I had not realised.



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 03/07/2018 02:00 PM
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Jole
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Lindsay, that's interesting as I've had this issue even with DPI 15.0
 03/07/2018 03:39 PM
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monkey8
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Originally posted by: Jole Lindsay, that's interesting as I've had this issue even with DPI 15.0
.

 

That's what I remember as well initially but I have changed to DPG since then and all I can say currently is that with DPG 15.0 the problem does not happen whereas with DPG 15.3 it does. So sorry but I can't really test with DPI 15 or DPI 15.3 at the moment. Nuance have confirmed it's an issue/bug with DPG 15.3 after I reported it to them. They will also test with 15.3 DPI I am sure.



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 03/08/2018 12:36 PM
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lennois
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Thank you monkey8! Your advice worked perfectly to completely eradicate that pesky DragonBar.

 03/09/2018 01:28 AM
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Jole
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Thanks Lindsay. It's a minor bug, but it's nice to know that they're looking at it.
 05/24/2019 04:57 PM
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kendonB
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This bug persists on DPI 15.3 in May 2019. Doesn't seem like they're looking at it...
 05/31/2019 11:42 AM
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Lunis Orcutt
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               Welcome to the World's Most Popular Speech Recognition Forum

For unknown reasons, Nuance has disabled the manual ability to open the Dragon options, when you mouse right click the Dragon Taskbar icon (when  Dragon is in Tray Icon Only mode). Clearly this was a Dragon developer oversight. You might re-consider using the default Modern DragonBar
. Of course you're in a bit of a catch 22 because you don't have a manual option. Fortunately you have a command option. If you're using KnowBrainer 2017 (third party command utility) say Appearance Options. If you're not using KnowBrainer, say show options followed by clicking the Ver. 15 Appearance tab, which in previous versions of Dragon, called the View tab. 



You might also consider filling out your member profile; especially if you're not using Ver. 15.



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 06/03/2019 12:58 PM
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Tiger Feet
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For unknown reasons, Nuance has disabled the manual ability to open the Dragon options, when you mouse right click the Dragon Taskbar icon (when  Dragon is in Tray Icon Only mode). Clearly this was a Dragon developer oversight.


Lunis,


This is not true, not in my case anyway.  I can right click my Dragon icon in the notification area and get to 'Appearance' that way if I choose.


Right click Dragon icon in notification area or system tray as it is sometimes called > Tools > Options > Appearance.


That is the long-winded way of doing it.  There are quicker ways to change the Dragonbar mode.  You have explained one in your post by saying, "show Dragon options" then "Appearance."


You can even switch Dragonbar mode with one command by saying,


"Switch DragonBar to tray icon mode"
"Switch DragonBar to docked to top mode"
"Switch DragonBar to docked to bottom mode"
"Switch DragonBar to floating mode"
"Switch DragonBar to cling mode"
"Switch DragonBar to modern mode"


Cheers



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Tiger Feet

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 06/03/2019 03:42 AM
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Stephan Kuepper
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Nuance doesn't look at it because they consider it a feature. As Chuck pointed out, the idea is to be able to access the elements in the Windows Start Menu by voice. When Windows 8 introduced the Metro interface, i.e. those tiles that everyone hated, Nuance responded by creating a DragonBar that would make it possible to access the tiles by voice. The Windows 10 start menu looks sufficiently alike to the Metro interface for Dragon to pull up the modern DragonBar.

The good news is that it goes away as soon as the Windows Start menu is closed.

Hope that helps, Stephan

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 06/04/2019 01:06 AM
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harpalus
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The DragonBar also appears if I open the Start Menu even though I have things set so that it should stay in the taskbar. Not only that, but I have had to give up on having Dragon automatically start with Windows. If I have it automatically start, most times the DragonBar opens up. I used to try and make it go down back to the taskbar manually but found that that required going into the options and setting the bar to be visible and then changing the settings back to the bar being restricted to the taskbar. Glad to learn that there is a verbal way to hopefully get the DragonBar back down to the taskbar. I may go back to having Dragon automatically start with Windows and see if the verbal commands work.

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 06/04/2019 05:34 AM
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Tiger Feet
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Gary,


In DPI 15/15.3, the modern DragonBar does indeed show when you open the start menu and when Dragon is in tray icon mode.  There are a set of instructions explained by Lindsay (monkey8) further up in this thread of how to stop this happening permanently.


If you want to disable it and stop it happening temporarily each session, just kill the Dragon DragonBar process in the task manager.


To do this say, "open task manager" and under 'Processes' in the task manager, highlight the entry that says, 'Dragon DragonBar' then click 'End task." 

Then when you click on or bring up the start menu, the modern DragonBar will no longer show.

Just remember, when you next restart your computer, when opening the start menu, the modern DragonBar will be back.  You will need to kill the 'Dragon DragonBar' process once again.


Cheers



-------------------------

Tiger Feet

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 06/04/2019 03:57 AM
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Stephan Kuepper
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Gary,

as I said, it's a friggin' feature. Granted, I don't use DPI so I can't say for certain, but in DPG and in DMPE the modern DragonBar goes away when closing the Windows Start menu. In those editions, the modern DragonBar is pretty small anyway, so nobody cares.

Rename dragonbar.exe as described above if it bothers you enough.

Hope that helps, Stephan

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 06/04/2019 07:26 AM
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Stephan Kuepper
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Would this merit an entry in the Knowbrainer Quick Tips?



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 06/04/2019 09:35 AM
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Tiger Feet
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I second that Stephan, great idea. Would quash a lot of confusion. See what Lunis thinks.

Cheers



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Tiger Feet

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 04/24/2020 07:18 AM
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xxtraloud
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Am I the only one still dealing with this problem? I have just installed 15.3 and when I push the Start/Windows key the Start menu open and the Dragon modern bar expands, and it prevents me from typing!!!

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 04/24/2020 08:34 AM
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Tiger Feet
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xxtraloud,

If you read through the posts above, there are several ways to combat this problem. Some of the solutions will prevent the modern DragonBar coming up on each session you use Dragon (see my posts on this). Some of the solutions will prevent the modern DragonBar coming up permanently, see Lindsay's (monkey8) posts on this further up.

Cheers



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Tiger Feet

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 04/24/2020 08:48 AM
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monkey8
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I know we have been here before and you said that renaming the Dragonbar.exe caused problems loading but I would suggest trying again. It definitely doesn't happen here.

 

This was what I was about to reply before seeing Andy's (Tiger feet) reply.

 

The new style Dragon bar will automatically appear whenever the metro interface appears.  The start menu is part of the metro interface.  It's partly because the old Dragon bars would not appear above the Metro interface due to permission levels so when they added the new dragonbar they made it appear automatically whenever the metro interface appears even if you have chosen system tray icon only.

 

You can resolve the problem by renaming the Dragon bar executable which is located here (at least with DPG 15.5), I have renamed it to DragonBar10.

 

"C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\Nuance\NaturallySpeaking15\dragonbar10.exe"

 

So the only problem now is what happens when you do want to see the new DragonBar.  All you need to do then is write a command which is a shortcut to the Dragonbar10.exe as shown above.

 

Upon initiating the shortcut above you MUST say "hide DragonBar" (even if it is not showing) before saying "show DragonBar" and it should all work fine.

 

Lastly this was reported to development and as Stephan had said earlier they consider it a feature and are reluctant to change.



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 04/29/2020 07:17 AM
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xxtraloud
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thanks Lindsay, I have tried again on a fresh installation to rename "DragonBar.exe" ( I do not have DragonBar10.exe), but when I start Dragon complains about that the setup.exe should be launched as a system administrator. The first of your solutions actually works by removing the path to the DragonBar from the .ini file. Thanks

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Win 10 - DPI 15 - AT 8 pro + Andrea USB

 05/23/2022 03:32 AM
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xxtraloud
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I am revamping this thread because after I have installed 15.6 the Dragon bar started to pop up again even if I disabled it from the menu. I followed the procedures in this thread, now the DragonBar does not bother me anymore but I cannot access any of the menus. If I right-click on the Dragon icon on the taskbar I only get the option to "Open" but when I selected nothing comes up. So something must have changed between 15.3 and 15.6. I had to disable the DragonBar because it was coming up also when I was opening the Windows start menu.

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Win 10 - DPI 15 - AT 8 pro + Andrea USB

 05/23/2022 04:22 PM
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monkey8
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Originally posted by: xxtraloud I am revamping this thread because after I have installed 15.6 the Dragon bar started to pop up again even if I disabled it from the menu. I followed the procedures in this thread, now the DragonBar does not bother me anymore but I cannot access any of the menus. If I right-click on the Dragon icon on the taskbar I only get the option to "Open" but when I selected nothing comes up. So something must have changed between 15.3 and 15.6. I had to disable the DragonBar because it was coming up also when I was opening the Windows start menu.

 

I don't know for sure about DPI 15.61 but with DPG 15.71 and for a long time before that with DPG I'm afraid you can't have your cake and eat it anymore regards the modern Dragon bar. You need to leave it be if you want to get to the menus unless you want to write quite a few scripts or a listvar script using the DgnEngineControl to access most, but not all, of the different dialogues that you can get to through the Dragon bar. But trust me you don't want to do that.

 

The new style Dragon bar will appear any time the Metro interface appears under Windows for reasons I have gone into before if you search the forum.



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 05/23/2022 09:34 AM
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Alan Cantor
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If you disabled DragonBar.exe by renaming it and have set the DragonBar to System Tray mode, use the hotkey to activate the DragonBar, which by default is NumPad *. You may need to press the hotkey twice, but the classic DragonBar should appear.
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