KnowBrainer Speech Recognition
Decrease font size
Increase font size
Topic Title: microphone replacement/upgrade
Topic Summary: ready to move up from ancient "bottom dollar" stuff
Created On: 05/01/2012 01:35 AM
Status: Post and Reply
Linear : Threading : Single : Branch
 microphone replacement/upgrade   - Camner - 05/01/2012 01:35 AM  
 microphone replacement/upgrade   - Lunis Orcutt - 05/01/2012 07:28 PM  
 microphone replacement/upgrade   - Camner - 05/05/2012 10:06 AM  
 microphone replacement/upgrade   - Camner - 05/05/2012 10:39 PM  
 microphone replacement/upgrade   - Lunis Orcutt - 05/06/2012 01:53 PM  
 microphone replacement/upgrade   - Camner - 05/09/2012 01:16 AM  
 microphone replacement/upgrade   - Chucker - 05/09/2012 05:37 AM  
 microphone replacement/upgrade   - Camner - 05/19/2012 12:48 AM  
 microphone replacement/upgrade   - Chucker - 05/19/2012 09:35 AM  
 microphone replacement/upgrade   - Lunis Orcutt - 05/19/2012 12:00 PM  
 microphone replacement/upgrade   - Camner - 05/20/2012 01:03 AM  
 microphone replacement/upgrade   - CtRptr - 05/25/2012 10:30 AM  
 microphone replacement/upgrade   - Lunis Orcutt - 05/25/2012 02:10 PM  
Keyword
 05/01/2012 01:35 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message


Camner
Power Member

Posts: 41
Joined: 03/05/2011

I use DNS 11.5 on a Windows 7 virtual machine on a couple of different Macs (a MacPro and a MacBook Pro).  I know that Nuance doesn't officially support this kind of setup, but I've had no problem with it.

 For microphones, I've been using a VXI Parrott TalkPro Express with an older Andrea USB pod soundcard as well as an Andrea ANC-650 mic with the same model soundcard.  I also have a Samson Go Mic.  Finally, I've also been trying the Dragon Remote Microphone app for the iPhone.

 Accuracy is reasonable, but not fabulous, with the Talk Pro Express.  Accuracy with the ANC-650 is not good; the audio setup keeps telling me that the signal is too high (odd?), and the only "fix" is to move the mic boom far enough away from my mouth (3 inches!) to reduce the volume that way (no, I'm not yelling).   The Samson is great for VoIP telephony but  I haven't gotten great DNS accuracy.  The Remote Microphone app actually has pretty good accuracy, but I can't always get a pairing with DNS, particularly on the MacBook Pro, so I hate to rely on it.

 I know I'm using older technology, so I think I'm ready to step up to something better.  I've looked around this site (forums and shop), and opinions obviously differ, which makes things difficult.  I'm most interested in accuracy, but I'm not prepared (at least not yet!) to pay "top dollar," though I'm certainly willing to pay more than the "bottom dollar" I paid for the stuff I described above.

So, a few questions...

1.  I've enjoyed not being tethered to my chair when using the Remote Mic app.  How good are wireless mics (such as the Stage 5...) in comparison with wired microphones? Is there a real tradeoff in accuracy for the pleasure of cord freedom? 

2.  Is there any point in replacing the old Andrea USB Pod soundcard with a newer, full duplex model, or can I leave well enough alone here?

3.   Any other advice about mics (corded, wireless, whatever) to improve the signal quality for the purposes of DNS accuracy?

 

Thank you! 

  

 05/01/2012 07:28 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Lunis Orcutt
Top-Tier Member

Posts: 22772
Joined: 10/01/2006

We see several possible issues:

1. The Samson GoMic is a substandard microphone which didn't meet our minimum requirements so we're not surprised by any problems you may be experiencing with it.

2. Your ANC 650 microphone dates back to the previous century and is extremely old so we don't know if it is fully up to snuff or not but if you're using 1 of the older ANC 1\2 duplex USB soundcards, it is probably a little too hot for that microphone and you may very well have to pull the microphone element about 3 inches from your mouth.

3. IPhone accuracy should be reasonable but, in your own words, probably not fabulous because it is, after all, an iPhone with a little integrated microphone. The fact that even works, is impressive in itself.

4. Your VXI TalkPro Xpress microphone is probably your best current microphone option even though it is also dated technology and was replaced last year.

To your questions…

1. As far as being wireless is concerned, it doesn't help or hinder so going wireless shouldn't factor into the accuracy part of your speech recognition equation.

2. There is no difference in the DSP chip in the newer Andrea Electronics USB soundcards. The only real difference is a lower noise floor on playback and the older ANC USB soundcards are a bit hotter but that isn't usually a problem with most microphones.

3. Our
Microphone Comparison Matrix is a good place to start because you can view our latest test results which compare pricing, accuracy, noise cancellation, features and even comfort.

If you are looking for inexpensive and wireless, the previously mentioned
Samson Stage 55 wireless microphone (w/KB PLUS PACK) is a good choice. On the downside, it includes a belt pack which means that your headset has to plug into the belt back as opposed to being completely wireless but on the upside, you can substitute any analog wired headset into this belt pack. Even your existing TalkPro Xpress microphone could be turned into a wireless microphone. We've already tested the Stage 55 with an Audio-Technica Pro 8HEmW but the included microphone is excellent.


-------------------------


Click KB 2012 REV D to Download a 30 Day Evaluation of KnowBrainer 2012
Click SpeechStart+ to Download a 15 Day Evaluation of SpeechStart+

 05/05/2012 10:06 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message


Camner
Power Member

Posts: 41
Joined: 03/05/2011

Thank you for your complete response.  I appreciate it and will look at your microphone matrix more carefully (I have looked at it a couple of times, but have not analyzed it carefully!).  Then, I guess it's time to take the plunge!
 05/05/2012 10:39 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message


Camner
Power Member

Posts: 41
Joined: 03/05/2011

I have now spent some time (a lot!) on your site, including the store site and the Microphone comparison, and I have some followup questions: 

 1.  The Samson Stage 55 comes with an SE10 microphone, and the site says it is upgradeable to the SE50.   It appears from your Microphone Comparison chart that the only real difference is a small increase in accuracy.  Is this correct or am I missing something?

2.  It seems that you feel that the Audio Technica Pro 8HEmw is superior to the SE10 or SE50 mics.  Is the Stage 55 available "bare" without the SE10 so it can be combined with the 8HEmw? (Or alternatively, is there a combo Stage 55 AT 8HEmw available?)

3.  Is the Buddy Flamingo a suitable substitute for the Buddy Desktop if I have a USB port close by (on my monitor, for example)? 

4.  Perhaps given the pricing structure (I'm not complaining, just noting!), it might be worth considering the Airline 77 at $300 vs. the Stage 55 + Audio Technica at @$129 x 2 = $258? 

 

Thank you! 

 

 05/06/2012 01:53 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Lunis Orcutt
Top-Tier Member

Posts: 22772
Joined: 10/01/2006

1. In our opinion, it's not so much a bump in accuracy as it is a flatter frequency response which makes very little difference in speech recognition. It would be far more noticeable for vocals so in our opinion, the SE50 doesn't justify the cost.

2. We also considered this option but came to the conclusion that Samson is literally sacrificing the
Samson Stage 55 for a bare-bones profit at $129. Check out the $100 price on the Samson SE10 low profile microphone and you'll see what we mean. They are basically charging $100 for the Stage 55 and throwing in the SE10 for an additional $29 but the product isn't available separately because the price is so attractive. The Audio-Technica Pro 8HEmW is awesome with the Stage 55 and even includes an appropriate 4 foot cable but if you're going to go that far, you might as well spend an extra $50 and go for the Samson Airline 77 which features a slightly better microphone and doesn't require a belt pack transmitter. The Stage 55 would be a perfect addition for someone who already owns the Pro 8HEmW. This is 1 of the reasons we introduced it.

3. The
Buddy Flamingo is quite literally a Buddy Desktop without the base or pushbutton options but the important thing to remember is that you will need to be within 6 inches of the microphone element. Our favorite Buddy Flamingo use is on tablet computers. Our main concern with short range desktop microphones is that you'll have to sit in a frozen position for too long. This is 1 of the key reasons why we prefer the SpeechWare 3-in-1 TableMike for workstations.

4. Exactly what we were thinking in question #2 and you would be getting extra amenities such as a UHF frequency band, no belt pack, a slightly better microphone and a noise gate.

PS: There is 1 advantage of owning the Stage 55 with the Pro 8HEmW. You would be able to go wireless at the office but have the option of carrying a much smaller wired microphone (8HEmW by itself) when using a notebook computer or going mobile.


-------------------------


Click KB 2012 REV D to Download a 30 Day Evaluation of KnowBrainer 2012
Click SpeechStart+ to Download a 15 Day Evaluation of SpeechStart+

 05/09/2012 01:16 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message


Camner
Power Member

Posts: 41
Joined: 03/05/2011

Thanks for your detailed response.  I went to the Samson website to look at the Airline 77 and noticed that it is worn behind the head/neck "reverse glasses style" (that is, with glasses-style temples that hook over the ears). Does this work well if one already wears specs?  I couldn't possible read my monitor without my glasses on!  I guess by "does it work well?" I mean "is it comfortable?"

The Stage 55 looks to be a typical "over the head" style mic, and I've never had that interfere or be interfered with by glasses.

Your point about the potential advantage of the Stage 55 with a detachable mike is interesting and worthy of some thought.

Thanks again! 

 05/09/2012 05:37 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Chucker
Top-Tier Member

Posts: 9766
Joined: 10/10/2006

Quote:
Thanks for your detailed response.  I went to the Samson website to look at the Airline 77 and noticed that it is worn behind the head/neck "reverse glasses style" (that is, with glasses-style temples that hook over the ears). Does this work well if one already wears specs?  I couldn't possible read my monitor without my glasses on!  I guess by "does it work well?" I mean "is it comfortable?"

Camner,

I wear prescription glasses for both reading and driving. Like you, I need my reading glasses when working on the computer and using Dragon NaturallySpeaking. As to whether or not the Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone headset is comfortable has been debated by some who have larger head sizes. However, I have never found the Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone headset to be either uncomfortable or interfere with my wearing glasses and I've been using the Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone now for well over five years.

I haven't used, but I've taken a look at, the Stage 5 series microphones from Samson. Based on the technical specifications I think that you would find the Stage 5 series microphones a viable alternative if you are uncomfortable with an over the ear, behind the head headset like the Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone. However, there are a couple of caveats:

1. The Stage 55 is more prone to external EMI interference than the Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone (i.e., large bank overhead fluorescent lighting or anything producing a strong EMI field anywhere near the belt pack or receiver.

2. The Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone is better suited for speech recognition by virtue of the microphone element and noise canceling capabilities.

3. I personally dislike dangling wires that can get in the way of movement and/or use as a result of the fact that the Stage 55 requires a belt pack whereas the Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone transmitter is an all contained unit on the back of the headset, which is generally unobtrusive, except for disabled users for whom the self-contained transmitter on the headset for the Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone might interfere with their head rests and/or having to lie down.

4. For all practical purposes, not taking into consideration issues surrounding the headset and microphone elements, the Stage 55 microphone is essentially a Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone without the Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone headset and self-contained wireless transmitter.

5. Performance and accuracy being able to use alternative headsets with the Stage 55 has not been thoroughly tested, whereas the Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone has and does provide top-of-the-line performance and accuracy with Dragon NaturallySpeaking.

My own personal preferences to have everything contained in the headset rather than using the belt pack with an alternative headset. For example, if you wanted to use the VXI TalkPro with its standard extra long cable and headphone connector would not be viable with the Stage 55. In addition, with the Stage 55 there is no accommodating headset microphones with earphones. That is, there is no audio output capability. The belt pack is a one-way transmitter. It would be extremely awkward trying to use a combination microphone/headphone headset with this unit.

Overall, my preferences for the Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone. However, that's my own personal preference for the reasons stated above. If your situation requires the specifications of the Stage 55, or you would find the Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone uncomfortable, then the Stage 55 would likely be a viable alternative. However, I think it important to take into consideration the various strengths and weaknesses relative to how you need to work with Dragon NaturallySpeaking and your personal ergonomic situation.

Chuck Runquist
Technical Project Manager
VoiceTeach LLC
Home of VoicePower®: We don't make Dragon NaturallySpeaking, We make it better!

"Many of the things you can count, don't count. Many of the things you can't count, really count." Albert Einstein



-------------------------

 05/19/2012 12:48 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message


Camner
Power Member

Posts: 41
Joined: 03/05/2011

Thanks again for the complete response.  I'm heading for the Samson Airline 77 I think.  Two final questions:

 

1.  I would only need the ANC half duplex USB adapter, correct, as the 77 is a transmitter only?

2.  What is KnowBrainer's return policy, in case I have a fat head and it doesn't fit well? 

 05/19/2012 09:35 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Chucker
Top-Tier Member

Posts: 9766
Joined: 10/10/2006

Quote:
1. I would only need the ANC half duplex USB adapter, correct, as the 77 is a transmitter only?

Camner,

Because the Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone does not have earphones, the Andrea half duplex USB SoundPod works just fine and is basically all that you need. The Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone has a base station (receiver) which is connected to the USB pod on the microphone side (i.e., the transmitter is on the headset). Regardless, the receiver (base station) only outputs to the USB SoundPod what it captures from the transmitter on the headset. You are correct in that there is no audio back to the headset.

That being said, I like using the Andrea Andrea PureAudio USB-SA because the Andrea half duplex requires that you connect the other side (audio out) directly to your soundcard in order to listen through headphones or earphones. Therefore, if you don't want to hear the playback through your computer speakers, you'll end up wrapping your leg around your neck with the Andrea half duplex. On the other side, you can also disable the Andrea PureAudio USB-SA output and use your speakers if you wish by simply right clicking on the speaker icon in the system tray (systray) and selecting the Playback device. You can then select the default playback device as your standard soundcard speakers and your audio will playback through the speakers. When you use the Andrea PureAudio USB-SA, the default Playback device is the Andrea PureAudio USB-SA. Just change it. I like the Andrea PureAudio USB-SA because I like using headphones rather than listening through my speakers. It avoids anything coming through the speakers from interfering with the Samson Airline 77 wireless microphone, which can happen from time to time with any microphone even if it ignores it (i.e., noise canceling).

Chuck Runquist
Technical Project Manager
VoiceTeach LLC
Home of VoicePower®: We don't make Dragon NaturallySpeaking, We make it better!

"Many of the things you can count, don't count. Many of the things you can't count, really count." Albert Einstein



-------------------------

 05/19/2012 12:00 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Lunis Orcutt
Top-Tier Member

Posts: 22772
Joined: 10/01/2006

Our return policy is a 30 day customer satisfaction no restock fee guarantee. We only ask that you request an RMA so that we know why it's being returned.

-------------------------


Click KB 2012 REV D to Download a 30 Day Evaluation of KnowBrainer 2012
Click SpeechStart+ to Download a 15 Day Evaluation of SpeechStart+

 05/20/2012 01:03 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message


Camner
Power Member

Posts: 41
Joined: 03/05/2011

Thanks both to Lunis and Chucker for your responses.  I'll order the Airline 77 and perhaps the Andrea PureAudio USB-SA shortly.  I'll wait a bit until I have a good 30 days of not traveling so I get a good opportunity to try it out.

 

 

 05/25/2012 10:30 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message


CtRptr
Senior Member

Posts: 97
Joined: 10/02/2006

Went to the Store, found a "review" by Lunis of the Andrea PureAudio USB-SA USB Pod. Clicked the link, found the document removed or not available. Will I find it somewhere else in this site?

-------------------------

Asus, Intel(R) Core(TM)i7 CPU Q 740 @1.73GHz 1.73GHz, 64-bit, 8G RAM, Windows 7 Professional, DNS 12 Professional

 05/25/2012 02:10 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Lunis Orcutt
Top-Tier Member

Posts: 22772
Joined: 10/01/2006

We couldn't find a review on the PureAudio USB-SA Pod external soundcard but keep in mind that from a speech recognition perspective, all USB soundcards are equal with the exception of the Buddy 7G which is not compatible with the Airline 77. The PureAudio advantage is that it is full duplex, inexpensive and small for portability. The advantage of the ANC USB Pod is that it is the least expensive USB soundcard and only 1\2 duplex which means that it doesn't steal your sound system. The reason why we recommend it for the Airline 77 is because the Airline 77 is limited to sound out which means there's no reason to use a full duplex USB soundcard. That's why you will see the 1\2 duplex Andrea Electronics USB soundcard highlighted when you click the green Select This Item button.



-------------------------


Click KB 2012 REV D to Download a 30 Day Evaluation of KnowBrainer 2012
Click SpeechStart+ to Download a 15 Day Evaluation of SpeechStart+



KnowBrainer Speech Recognition » Microphones and Sound Cards » microphone replacement/upgrade

Statistics
27430 users are registered to the KnowBrainer Speech Recognition forum.
There are currently 5 users logged in.
The most users ever online was 2028 on 04/05/2013 at 07:36 PM.
There are currently 178 guests browsing this forum, which makes a total of 183 users using this forum.

FuseTalk Standard Edition v4.0 - © 1999-2013 FuseTalk™ Inc. All rights reserved.