KnowBrainer Speech Recognition
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Topic Title: Dragonfly Programmers/Users?
Topic Summary:
Created On: 09/13/2014 10:48 PM
Status: Post and Reply
Linear : Threading : Single : Branch
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - synkarius - 09/13/2014 10:48 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - Codebold - 11/12/2014 11:30 AM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - synkarius - 11/12/2014 03:09 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - NoBit - 01/22/2015 12:47 AM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - synkarius - 01/26/2015 11:52 AM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - chajadan - 02/13/2015 05:06 AM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - synkarius - 02/13/2015 09:54 AM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - Baukran - 02/04/2016 05:03 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - synkarius - 02/04/2016 08:18 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - Baukran - 02/05/2016 10:56 AM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - namegoeshere - 07/14/2016 02:50 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - JND2012 - 01/04/2017 08:07 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - rlquey2 - 03/28/2017 01:38 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - rob - 04/20/2017 08:30 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - Lunis Orcutt - 04/21/2017 11:57 AM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - rob - 04/26/2017 09:49 AM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - haughki - 04/26/2017 05:21 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - rob - 04/26/2017 05:50 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - haughki - 04/27/2017 05:56 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - rob - 04/27/2017 07:28 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - alexander - 05/02/2017 02:55 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - rob - 05/03/2017 05:21 AM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - alexander - 05/07/2017 01:46 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - quintijn - 05/31/2017 11:46 AM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - alexander - 05/31/2017 08:16 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - michaelbeijer - 11/17/2017 05:49 PM  
 Dragonfly Programmers/Users?   - alexander - 11/24/2017 03:23 PM  
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 09/13/2014 10:48 PM
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synkarius
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Hello All,

 

I've discovered a handful of Dragonfly programmers/users on Github and Twitter, and now that KnowBrainer has been gracious enough to pick up the slack for SpeechComputing, I thought I'd introduce myself and see if there are any more here. Don't be shy! I'd love to connect and exchange ideas. I am subscribing to this topic, so please necro it even if you are reading it years from the post date.

 

synkarius



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Caster : DNS/Dragonfly voice programming freeware



 11/12/2014 11:30 AM
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Codebold
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Hey Synkarius!

Same here... Would also like to exchange ideas and find solutions together. I started using DNS with NatLink and Dragonfly around the time speechcomputing.com died, so I had to get over many pitfalls on my own. Maybe we could start an IRC channel on freenode or do a hangout sometimes.

Codebold
 11/12/2014 03:09 PM
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synkarius
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Good to meet you, Codebold! I'd be up for either of those. I currently live in Seoul, South Korea, so the time zones might be a little difficult, but if you want to set something up, send me a private message.



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Caster : DNS/Dragonfly voice programming freeware

 01/22/2015 12:47 AM
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NoBit
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Greetings I've just started tinkering with dragonfly. Although I'm finding it difficult to install things from the community. I'm trying to get this set up so I can start teaching myself my first programming language Java by voice from the start.

I'm hoping to integrate Dragon using dragonfly IntelliJ IDEA, sublime text 2 and possibly eclipse.



 01/26/2015 11:52 AM
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synkarius
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Hello NoBit. Doing what you're looking to do is certainly possible: using Dragon and Dragonfly to control those three IDEs, in order to program in Java, or any other language. You're going to have to learn a bit of Python too, in order to customize Dragonfly to fit your needs. When you do, you'll want to look at the AppContext class and the _multiedit.py module.

 

I may be able to help you install the things from the community that you're having trouble with. If you'd like help, please let me know more details.



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Caster : DNS/Dragonfly voice programming freeware

 02/13/2015 05:06 AM
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chajadan
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Hello,

My name is Charlie. I am currently working with voice programming. So far I'm doing all of my work through dragonfly. For the most part things are going pretty well, and I quickly upgraded to Dragon because Windows speech recognition made rudimentary mistakes. I do a lot of automation coding, so adding voice to it just makes sense, plus I have wrist issues. One of the issues I'm currently working on is that certain words seem to be intercepted by the Dragon engine so my code can't use them as expected. I know this is been brought up other places, and I'm not looking for answers in this thread, just to keep the focus on meeting new people, so consider this me saying hi. =)
 02/13/2015 09:54 AM
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synkarius
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Hello Charlie,

 

Welcome. It's good to meet you. I've had much the same experience as you with Windows Speech Recognition, and I also have wrist issues which have been largely mitigated by Dragon and Dragonfly. And yeah, I can tell that you've done your homework regarding the Dragon-executing-built-in-commands-before-sending-to-Dragonfly issue; I don't know the answer to that one either.



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Caster : DNS/Dragonfly voice programming freeware

 02/04/2016 05:03 PM
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Baukran
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Hey all!

As soon as my microphone arrives I'll try to set up DNS 13 premium + Dragonfly. I'm having pain in my elbows, so I'm very interested in voice programming! Its great to read that a lot of people are working on this topic and share their knowledge, although it's a bit confusing to me where to start because there seem to be a lot of different approachs how to structure your grammar and so on.

@synkarius Caster looks great! I'll definitively try this to control my mouse. I hope that I can take your project as a starting point for / while learning how to code for Dragonly and at best contribute to your project, if you approve! I'm unsure where to ask if I'm having question questions how to use Caster. E.g. I could not find in the CasterQuickReference0.5.3.pdf information on how to navigate in textfiles / an IDE (how to move X lines up / down or Y chars to the left / right). Is the Issue section on GitHub the right place for this? At the moment most of the questions and issues seem to be related to development and I'm not sure if these user questions / discussions fit there.



 02/04/2016 08:18 PM
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synkarius
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Hi Baukran.

 

Thank you for the compliment! Welcome aboard; both your contributions and questions are welcome and encouraged. Probably the best place to get your questions answered would be in the Github chat. There are a handful of experienced Caster users/developers in there who are pretty good about that. Obviously, they're good at Dragonfly too.

 

As for simple navigation commands for text editors (and IDEs), try the "shin", "queue", and "fly" commands from section 4 of the Quick Reference, and the directional commands from the end of section 2. Some examples:

 

"shin" - highlight one character (shift+right -- right is the default)

"queue" - highlight one word (ctrl+shift+right -- right is the default)

"fly two" - move the cursor ahead two words (ctrl+right x2 -- right is the default)

"queue lease" - highlight one word left (shift+left)

"shin dunce five" - highlight five lines down from the cursor (shift+down x5)

"sauce five" - move the cursor up five lines (up x5)

 

There are also IDE-specific commands for Eclipse, Atom, Sublime, MSVC, Emacs, Pycharm/IntelliJ, and Visual Studio, and very soon, advanced line ops (navigation/search) commands for those IDEs. Those are not documented, but if you open up the respective .py files in the /apps/ folder, you can see them. 



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Caster : DNS/Dragonfly voice programming freeware



 02/05/2016 10:56 AM
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Baukran
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Cool! I haven't heard of this chat feature before (and I just noticed that I didn't read the Contributing page carefully enough).

Thank you for your fast reply. I hope to participate soon.
 07/14/2016 02:50 PM
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namegoeshere
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This is super useful, thanks

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 01/04/2017 08:07 PM
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JND2012
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Thank you for starting this thread. I have not yet graduated to Dragonfly, but I will get there in the foreseeable future. Right now I am still tinkering with the ins and outs of customizing Dragon. I definitely want to learn to code by voice, though, so I will check back in when I am further along.
 03/28/2017 01:38 PM
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rlquey2
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Hello, I've been using Dragonfly and Caster for a few months, and was using Vocola before too. Couldn't program without it; thanks for your involvement in this community
 04/20/2017 08:30 PM
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rob
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Hi,

I'm trying to learn to program using speech recognition and it would be good to get basic info. Could you tell what the difference is between making your own custom commands in dragon naturally speaking professional individual for frequently used snippets, key bindings, camel case etc versus what can you do in Dragonfly?

I know this is probably a really newb question but yeah I am new to it.

Thanks,

Rob



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Dragon Professional Group 15.6 with knowbrainer 2017 professional and speech start.



 04/21/2017 11:57 AM
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Lunis Orcutt
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Our Dragonfly information is extremely limited (please don't hold it against us) because we play for the other team. We are only commenting because you might consider filling out your member profile so that we know what version and edition of Dragon you are using. For example, if you are using 1 of the professional versions of Dragon, you can do a lot with the included command creating tools. It won't be nearly as fast (because Dragon uses an out of date scripting engine) or as capable as Dragonfly but it will usually get the job done. Also note that Dragonfly, Vocola etc. cannot be used with Dragon 15 which is based on the Deep Learning speech engine. Dragonfly can only be used with Dragon 14 and previous versions which may have some effect on your final decision.

If you decide to write your commands in Dragon, you might consider obtaining the Larry Allen's Scripting for Dragon .

You will also find more support on Third-party Command Utilities because they are sold for profit. For example, KnowBrainer 2017 utilizes VB scripting which is more limited than Dragonfly but includes 8000 built-in example commands; including 255 pseudo-artificial intelligence commands. Unlike built-in Dragon commands, you can view and edit all KnowBrainer commands. You'll find a 30 day trial in our signature tag and you can copy most KnowBrainer commands directly into Dragon, should you wish to freely use this technology. Copying and editing existing commands is a great way to learn command writing and VB can be used in a lot of places. KnowBrainer also has the advantage of a patented command writing technology called VerbalBasic; about 10 times faster than typing VB while simplifying the learning curve.



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 04/26/2017 09:49 AM
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rob
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Thanks for the reply.

Do you mean the dragon engine doesn't run scripts as fast as Dragonfly?
I use dragon professional individual v15 I suppose I could downgrade to an earlier version though. But I think I would also have to downgrade from windows 10 because as far as I know Dragonfly will not run on windows 10.

I have written some custom commands with the version of dragon I'm using and they seem to run ok.

I actually have the knowbrainer software, the 2008 version, but don't think it works with Dragon professional individual v15, how do I upgrade?

I do like the look of the voice code software that is currently only available for mac but I have a desktop pc, I'm looking to buy a laptop but getting a decent configuration mac book pro to run speech recognition well, is so much more expensive than for example buying a dell xps 13 of a high spec.

Being able to chain commands with Dragonfly or voice code would be good but I'm not sure I'm a fast enough coder to need to chain commands just now.

Also do you know if Dragonfly comes with a library of pre defined commands?

Thanks,

 

Rob



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Dragon Professional Group 15.6 with knowbrainer 2017 professional and speech start.



 04/26/2017 05:21 PM
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haughki
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Originally posted by: rob ...as far as I know Dragonfly will not run on windows 10. 

 

...Also do you know if Dragonfly comes with a library of pre defined commands?

 

I have not done it, but I don't remember hearing any problem with Dragonfly on Windows 10.  Seems like it should work, but maybe I'm missing something.  Do you have a source for that?

 

Dragonfly is open source.  The community isn't huge, and the orginal source is many years old.  The documentation is good, but fragmented, and if you follow it, you find errors here and there.  I love it and use it extensively, but my point is, unless you're already a decent programmer or excited about a significant project and learning curve, it's probably not what you want.  As Lunis pointed out, Dragonfly doesn't work with the latest version of DNS (v.15), and we have no idea if this issue with ever be fixed.  So, if you decided to jump in now, you're taking a risk that you won't ever be able to upgrade your DNS version.

 

All that said, there are a lot of reasons why some people have favored the various open source, NatLink-based solutions (Vocola, Unimacro, Dragonfly, ?) over DNS's Advanced Scripting.  A big one seems to be continuous command recognition.  As far as I know, you can't do this with DNS's Advanced Scripting.  There are a ton of other reasons, too many to list here.  For me, avoiding VBScript, using a non-proprietary solution, having complete access to the Python ecosystem of libraries, are a few.

 

In terms of "pre-defined commands":  I don't think that installing Dragonfly will create any pre-defined commands.  Many people, however, have created and published numerous command modules for dragonfly, modules you can copy/re-use freely.  You can find some examples here:

http://dragonfly.readthedocs.io/en/latest/related_resources.html#command-modules

 

A few other Dragonfly resources:

http://dragonfly.readthedocs.io/en/latest/index.html

 

http://caster.readthedocs.io/en/latest/caster/doc/readthedocs/Voice%20Index/

- a treasure trove of info and links on dragonfly and related

 



 04/26/2017 05:50 PM
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rob
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Hi, thanks for the reply. I thought I had read it somewhere but I cannot find the source now. Although I cannot find anyone from forums etc that has it installed on Windows 10.

I have seen now that a lot of users make their predefined commands available so that would be handy.

I have older versions of Dragon NaturallySpeaking I could use it with so I might have a go at installing Dragonfly.

Do you know anyone who has tried the voice code software that is currently only available for Mac and how that compares to Dragonfly?

 

Thanks,

 

Rob



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Dragon Professional Group 15.6 with knowbrainer 2017 professional and speech start.



 04/27/2017 05:56 PM
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haughki
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"Do you know anyone who has tried the voice code software that is currently only available for Mac and how that compares to Dragonfly?"

 

Which software are you talking about?  Link?  I haven't used any mac voice software, but there may be someone else on the list who has.

 04/27/2017 07:28 PM
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rob
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Hi,

Here is the link for voice code http://voicecode.io/#about

Thanks,

Rob



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Dragon Professional Group 15.6 with knowbrainer 2017 professional and speech start.



 05/02/2017 02:55 PM
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alexander
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Rob, have you considered using Vocola instead? It significantly simpler than dragonfly, but still provides continuous command recognition as well as an extension mechanism to write Python code should you require more power. As with dragonfly requires DPI 14 or lower.
 05/03/2017 05:21 AM
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rob
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Yeah I saw Vocola but had seen more people seemed to be using Dragonfly for coding. In what ways is it simpler than dragonfly?

Thanks,

Rob

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Dragon Professional Group 15.6 with knowbrainer 2017 professional and speech start.

 05/07/2017 01:46 PM
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alexander
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Dig around here: http://vocola.net/v2/LanguageTutorial.asp and post back if you have questions.
http://vocola.net/default.asp



 05/31/2017 11:46 AM
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quintijn
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Vocola is easier to start with than Dragonfly and caster. Dragonfly is more powerful, especially with chaining commands in one utterance. Programmers will want to turn to Dragonfly/Caster, of which I only now viewed very instructive video's made by Synkarios. Thanks!

Unimacro offers also some chaining of commands feature, but should be documented better. One of my plans for the future.

For non-programmers, I think Vocola and Unimacro offers easier to install and maintain solutions. I will however move on with some Dragonfly/Caster study and efforts.

Note: all these things rely on NatLink, which is currently broken for Dragon 15.


 05/31/2017 08:16 PM
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alexander
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fwiw, Vocola does allow for chaining of commands:
http://vocola.net/v2/CommandSequences.asp  
as well as writing full on Python code:
http://vocola.net/v2/Extensions.asp

 

I did a reasonable amount of research on both, and settled with Vocola because I had already written some scripts and didn't want to rewrite them.  

 

I think one place where you will see the big value add from going the dragonfly route is if you use caster.  There are a number of prebuilt classes and a standard language that Dave has built up and has applied to multiple programming languages including C++, JavaScript, HTML, Python etc.. I believe it would be possible to duplicate most of this in Vocola, but why bother when it's already there?

 

https://github.com/synkarius/caster/blob/master/caster/lib/ccr/standard.py

https://github.com/synkarius/caster/tree/master/caster/lib/ccr

 

caster also has a number of out-of-the-box goodies like navigation etc.

 

again I don't think that it's fundamentally anything that could not be done in Vocola, and for better or worse I have actually duplicated some of this in Vocola.

 

Also for what it's worth, I have been successful at running Vocola and caster/dragonfly on the same system at the same time.  Caster has commands for turning continuous command recognition on and off for different languages, which can be quite handy.

 

 



 11/17/2017 05:49 PM
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michaelbeijer
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Just repeating rob's question: has anyone here used or having any experience with http://voicecode.io ?

Looks interesting but I'm not on a Mac.

Michael

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Dragon Professional Individual 15
KnowBrainer 2017 + AutoHotkey
Win 10 – 64-bit, i7, 32 GB RAM
SpeechWare 3-in-1 TableMike 

 11/24/2017 03:23 PM
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alexander
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You could try posting that question to:

http://discuss.voicecode.io/

 



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